Top 250 Tv Shows Like The Ring
A list of the best tv shows similar to The Ring. If you liked The Ring then you may also like: This Is Us, Expats, 'Allo 'Allo!, The Amazing World of Gumball, American Gothic and many more great tv shows featured on this list.
During WW II, a young German woman is separated from her family and imprisoned by the Nazis. After being freed she falls in love with and marries a German officer. When Berlin falls to the Russians, and her husband killed, she flees to America, carrying his unborn child, all the while not giving up hope that she will find her family, tied together by her mother's ring.
'Allo 'Allo!
The misadventures of hapless cafe owner René Artois and his escapades with the Resistance in occupied France.
The Amazing World of Gumball
The life of Gumball Watterson, a 12-year old cat who attends middle school in Elmore. Accompanied by his pet, adoptive brother, and best friend Darwin Watterson, he frequently finds himself involved in various shenanigans around the city, during which he interacts with various family members: Anais, Richard, and Nicole Watterson, and other various citizens.
American Gothic
A prominent Boston family attempts to redefine itself in the wake of a chilling discovery that links their recently deceased patriarch to a string of murders spanning decades — amid the mounting suspicion that one of them may have been his accomplice.
Big Little Lies
The tale of three mothers of first graders whose apparently perfect lives unravel to the point of murder.
Big Love
The story of Bill Henrickson and his life in suburban Salt Lake City, balancing the needs of his three wives -- Barb, Nicki and Margene-- their seven kids, three new houses and the opening of his newest hardware store. When disturbing news arrives about Bill's father, he is forced to reconnect with his polygamist parents who live on a fundamentalist compound in rural Utah.
Big Sky
Private detective Cassie Dewell partners with ex-cop Jenny Hoyt on a search for two sisters who have been kidnapped by a truck driver on a remote highway in Montana. When they discover that these are not the only girls who have disappeared in the area, they must race against the clock to stop the perpetrator before another woman is taken.
Call the Midwife
Drama following the lives of a group of midwives working in the poverty-stricken East End of London during the 1950s, based on the best-selling memoirs of Jennifer Worth.
The Client List
Riley Parks delicately balances two starkly different lives -- one as a single mom in a conservative town struggling to provide for her family and the other as a savvy and ambitious businesswoman working with a rowdy, sexy and unpredictable group of women.
Dead to Me
A hotheaded widow searching for the hit-and-run driver who mowed down her husband befriends an eccentric optimist who isn't quite what she seems.
The Fosters
Stef Foster, a dedicated police officer, and her partner Lena Adams, a school vice principal, have built a close-knit, loving family with Stef's biological son from a previous marriage, Brandon, and their adopted twins, Mariana and Jesus. Their lives are disrupted in unexpected ways when Lena meets Callie, a hardened teen with an abusive past who has spent her life in and out of foster homes. Lena and Stef welcome Callie and her brother, Jude, into their home thinking it's just for a few weeks, until a more permanent placement can be found. But life has something else in store for the Fosters.
Hey Arnold!
The daily life of Arnold--a fourth-grader with a wild imagination, street smarts and a head shaped like a football.
Hogan's Heroes
Hogan's Heroes is an American television sitcom that ran for 168 episodes from September 17, 1965, to July 4, 1971, on the CBS network. The show was set in a German prisoner of war camp during World War II. Bob Crane starred as Colonel Robert E. Hogan, coordinating an international crew of Allied prisoners running a Special Operations group from the camp. Werner Klemperer played Colonel Wilhelm Klink, the commandant of the camp, and John Banner was the inept sergeant-of-the-guard, Hans Schultz. The series was popular during its six-season run. In 2013, creators Bernard Fein through his estate and Albert S. Ruddy acquired the sequel and other separate rights to Hogan's Heroes from Mark Cuban through arbitration and a movie based on the show has been planned.
Homefront
Homefront is an American television drama series created and produced by Lynn Marie Latham and Bernard Lechowick in association with Warner Bros. Television for ABC. The show was set in the fictional city of River Run, Ohio in 1945, 1946, and 1947. The show's theme song, "Accentuate the Positive", was written by Johnny Mercer and performed by Jack Sheldon. Forty-two episodes were broadcast in the United States over two seasons from 1991 to 1993. TV Guide, Abigail Van Buren, and fans showed determination in getting ABC to continue the show for a third season before it was cancelled.
How I Met Your Mother
A father recounts to his children - through a series of flashbacks - the journey he and his four best friends took leading up to him meeting their mother.
Jane the Virgin
A comedy-drama following a chaste young woman who is accidentally impregnated via artificial insemination as she struggles to inform her devoutly religious family and make the right choices concerning the child. Based on the telenovela "Juana la virgen."
Life Goes On
Life Goes On is a television series that aired on ABC from September 12, 1989, to May 23, 1993. The show centers on the Thatcher family living in suburban Chicago: Drew, his wife Elizabeth, and their children Paige, Rebecca, and Charles, who is known as Corky. Life Goes On was the first television series to have a major character with Down syndrome.
The Lying Game
Emma, a kind-hearted foster kid who can't catch a break, finds out she has an identical twin sister, Sutton, who - unlike Emma - was adopted by wealthy parents and is seemingly living an ideal life. After their initial meeting, Sutton talks Emma into stepping into her life for a few days while she pursues a lead on their birth mother. Initially excited to do this favor for her sister, Emma soon learns that Sutton has gone missing and could be in trouble. Now, Emma must decide whether to come clean to Sutton's family and risk her own safety in the hope of uncovering her twin sister's true whereabouts, along with the truth about why they were separated in the first place.
McLeod's Daughters
When Jack McLeod passes away, his two daughters inherit Drovers Run, a vast cattle ranch in the Australian outback. Ultimately, Tess and Claire decide to run the ranch together, with their housekeeper, Meg, her teenage daughter, Jodi, and a local girl, Becky. Their lives are hard and the obstacles many, but the rewards are every bit as grand as the wild open land they've inherited.
Mike & Molly
A comedy about a working class Chicago couple who find love at an Overeaters Anonymous meeting.
My Wife and Kids
Michael Kyle is a loving husband and modern-day patriarch who rules his household with a unique and distinct parenting style. As he teaches his three children some of life's lessons, he does so with his own brand of humor.
Sharp Objects
Reporter Camille Preaker confronts the psychological demons from her past when she returns to her hometown to investigate the murders of two young girls.
Third Watch
The exploits of a group of men and women who serve the City of New York as police officers, firemen, and paramedics, all working the same fictional 55th precinct during the 3pm to 11pm shift - the 'Third Watch'.
United States of Tara
Tara's multiple personalities include "T" the wild-child teenager, "Buck" the rough and tumble biker dude, and "Alice" the type-A homemaker. But with a family that loves her just the way she is, Tara never gives up hope that someday she can just be herself.
The Young and the Restless
The rivalries, romances, hopes and fears of the residents of the fictional Midwestern metropolis, Genoa City. The lives and loves of a wide variety of characters mingle through the generations, dominated by the Newman, Abbott, Baldwin and Winters families.
Brideshead Revisited
Charles Ryder, an agnostic man, becomes involved with members of the Flytes, a Catholic family of aristocrats, over the course of several years between the two world wars.
A Bit of a Do
A Bit of a Do is a British comedy drama series based on the books by David Nobbs. The show starred David Jason and was aired on ITV in 1989. It was made for the ITV network by Yorkshire Television. The show was set in a fictional Yorkshire town. Each episode took place at a different social function and followed the changing lives of two families, the working-class Simcocks and the middle-class Rodenhursts, together with their respective friends, Rodney and Betty Sillitoe, and Neville Badger. The series begins with the wedding of Ted and Rita Simcock's son Paul to Laurence and Liz Rodenhurst's daughter Jenny; an event at which Ted and Liz begin an affair. The subsequent fallout from this affair forms the basis for most of the first series.
The Company
The Company tells the thrilling story of Cold War CIA agents imprisoned in double lives, fighting an amoral, elusive, formidable enemy – and each other – in an internecine battle within the Company itself.
Lark Rise to Candleford
Set in the small hamlet of Lark Rise and the wealthier neighbouring market town, Candleford, the series chronicles the daily lives of farm-workers, craftsmen and gentry at the end of the 19th Century. Lark Rise to Candleford is a love letter to a vanished corner of rural England and a heart-warming drama series teeming with wit, wisdom and romance.
Auschwitz: The Nazis and the Final Solution
This documentary series tackles one of history's most horrifying subjects: the Holocaust and the infamous Auschwitz-Birkenau concentration camp.
Enemy at the Door
Enemy At The Door is a British television drama series made by London Weekend Television for ITV. The series was shown between 1978 and 1980 and dealt with the German occupation of Guernsey, one of the Channel Islands, during the Second World War. The programme generated a certain amount of criticism in Guernsey, particularly for being obviously filmed on Jersey despite being ostensibly set on Guernsey. The series also marked the TV debut of Anthony Head as a member of the island resistance. The theme music was by Wilfred Josephs.
The Diary of Anne Frank
Five-part adaptation of Anne Frank's famous wartime diaries in which a young teenager and her family go into hiding from the Nazis in wartime Amsterdam.
War and Remembrance
War and Remembrance is an American miniseries based on the novel of the same name by Herman Wouk. It is the sequel to highly successful The Winds of War.
Raising Hope
James "Jimmy" Chance is a clueless 24-year-old who impregnates a serial killer during a one-night-stand. Earning custody of his daughter after the mother is sentenced to death, Jimmy relies on his oddball but well-intentioned family for support in raising the child.
Unknown War
A documentary television series of the Nazi-Soviet War, edited from over 3.5 million feet of film taken by Soviet camera crews from the first day of the war, 22 June 1941, to the Soviet entry into Berlin in May 1945.
Apocalypse: The Second World War
A six-part French documentary about the Second World War composed exclusively of actual footage of the war as filmed by war correspondents, soldiers, resistance fighters and private citizens. The series is shown in color, with the black and white footage being fully colorized, save for some original color footage. The only exception to the treatment are most Holocaust scenes, which are presented in the original black and white.
Mistral's Daughter
Beautiful and naïve Maggy Lunel arrives in Paris completely broke. She becomes an artist's model and the toast of Paris, attracting the attention of Picasso-like painter Julien Mistral, an arrogant and selfish man who places his work above everything. Their paths diverge as Mistral's art catches the eye of a rich American woman who becomes his patroness and eventually his wife. During the war years in France, Mistral collaborates with the Nazis in order to continue with his work, a decision that will come back to haunt him years later. In the meantime, Maggy has a daughter named Teddy who grows up and falls in love with Mistral with whom she has a child named Fauve. As Mistral ages, he comes to terms with his selfish past and wartime betrayal through his art, leaving a beautiful legacy for his daughter, Fauve.
The Third Reich: The Rise & Fall
An intimate, authentic portrait of Hitler's Germany as recorded by the people who lived it. Never-before-seen home movies, Nazi propaganda films and personal recollections culled from German's diaries, journals and letters provide a rare look inside the darker pages of world history.
The Sinking of the Laconia
The true story of the Allied ship Laconia, sunk in WWII by a German U-Boat, which then surfaced against orders to rescue the civilian crew
Mildred Pierce
Mildred Pierce depicts an overprotective, self-sacrificing mother during the Great Depression who finds herself separated from her husband, opening a restaurant of her own and falling in love with a man, all the while trying to earn her spoiled, narcissistic daughter's love and respect.
Mussolini: The Untold Story
The rise and fall of Italy's fascist dictator Benito Mussolini. Recounting his life with his wife, children and mistress, this biography (based on the recollections of Mussolini's eldest son, Vittorio) chronicles Il Duce's tyranny as he plunges Italy into the dark days of World War II.
The Winds of War
Set against the backdrop of world events that led to the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor in 1941, Victor "Pug" Henry is a career naval officer who, along with his family, learns to navigate the waters of his dangerous times in the late 1930s.
Finding Your Roots
Noted Harvard scholar Henry Louis Gates, Jr. has been helping people discover long-lost relatives hidden for generations within the branches of their family trees. Professor Gates utilizes a team of genealogists to reconstruct the paper trail left behind by our ancestors and the world’s leading geneticists to decode our DNA and help us travel thousands of years into the past to discover the origins of our earliest forebears.
Small Island
Follow three intricately connected stories of Jamaicans and Londoners involved in World War Two. Hortense yearns for a new life away from rural Jamaica, Gilbert dreams of becoming a lawyer, and Queenie longs to escape her Lincolnshire roots. Hope and humanity meet stubborn reality as we trace the tangled history of Jamaica and the UK.
Spies of Warsaw
A military attaché at the French embassy is drawn into a world of abduction, betrayal and intrigue in the diplomatic salons and back alleys of Warsaw. A classic tale of spying, intrigue, and romance, based on the novels of Alan Furst and adapted by Dick Clement and Ian La Frenais.
The Man in the High Castle
Explore what it would be like if the Allied Powers had lost WWII, and Japan and Germany ruled the United States. Based on Philip K. Dick's award-winning novel.
Lightfields
The story follows three families that each lived in Lightfields farmhouse at different time periods (1944, 1975 and 2012) but who are linked by a spine-chilling presence: the ghost of a teenage girl who died in mysterious and tragic circumstances.
WPC 56
Drama following WPC Gina Dawson, the first Woman Police Constable to join Brinford Constabulary, a fictional police force in the West Midlands, in 1956. The show focuses on WPC Gina Dawson's struggle to gain acceptance in the male-dominated police station whilst having to deal with the sexist attitudes that were commonplace at the time.
Nazi Megastructures
In a quest for world domination, the Nazis built some of the biggest and deadliest pieces of military hardware and malevolent technology in history. This is the stories of the engineers who designed them and how these structures sparked a technological revolution that changed warfare forever.
Fleming
Set at the outbreak of WWII – mischievous playboy Ian Fleming is untroubled by the specter of impending war – chasing women, collecting rare books and living off his family fortune. Forever in the shadow of his brother Peter, and an eternal disappointment to his formidable mother Eve, Fleming dreams of becoming the ‘ultimate’ man – a hero, a lover, a brute and the one who always gets the girl. He is finally given some direction in his life when he’s recruited by the Director of Naval Intelligence to help in the effort against the Nazis. Suddenly, Fleming finds his chance to shine and prove his worth.
Rosemary's Baby
Young Rosemary Woodhouse and her husband Guy move in with a rich couple, who soon take an unusual interest in the Woodhouses' attempts to have a second baby after Rosemary miscarried the first one. Guy soon has unusual success and Rosemary becomes pregnant, but it becomes clear that the two are connected and that the pregnancy may not be all that Rosemary hoped for...
Poldark
Britain is in the grip of a chilling recession... falling wages, rising prices, civil unrest - only the bankers are smiling. It's 1783 and Ross Poldark returns from the American War of Independence to his beloved Cornwall to find his world in ruins: his father dead, the family mine long since closed, his house wrecked and his sweetheart pledged to marry his cousin. But Ross finds that hope and love can be found when you are least expecting it in the wild but beautiful Cornish landscape.
Home Fires
The story of a group of inspirational women in a rural Cheshire community with the shadow of World War II casting a dark cloud over their lives. As the conflict takes hold and separates the women from their husbands, fathers, sons and brothers, the characters find themselves under increasing and extraordinary pressures in a rapidly fragmenting world. By banding together as the Great Paxford Women’s Institute, they help maintain the nation’s fabric in its darkest hour, and discover inner resources that will change their lives forever.
Act of Will
Act of Will is a 1989 mini-series directed by Don Sharp. It the third mini series based on a Barbara Taylor Bradford novel he had directed and was an early lead role for Elizabeth Hurley.
Workin' Moms
Four women juggle love, careers, and parenthood. They support, challenge, and try not to judge each other as life throws them curveballs. Whether it is an identity crisis, a huge job opportunity, postpartum depression, or an unplanned pregnancy – they face both the good and bad with grace and humour.
Mama June Family Crisis
June Shannon ('Mama June') gained fame as the mother of young beauty-pageant contestant 'Honey Boo Boo' (Alana Thompson) on various reality shows. With that notoriety came jokes from comedians and people on social media about her weight. Ending her marriage to Sugar Bear and facing health issues, Mama June wants to slim down so she can start a new life with a new body and, she hopes, a new love.
Nazi Secret Files
Adolf Hitler is one of the world's most terrifying - and most studied - historical figures. Nazi Secret Files suggests that there is still much to know about this deadly dictator. Nazi Secret Filesis a thrilling, six-part series examining newly-discovered information about Hitler and those close to him during the Nazi reign - from exposing the huge drug program that fueled the Nazi war machine, to fresh evidence proving the Nazis were colluding with experts on germ warfare. An in-depth exploration on how an unremarkable drifter from Vienna instigated the most devastating military conflict in history, Nazi Secret Files reveals the incredible story of mass hysteria, bizarre beliefs, and dangerous delusions that ended with a religious war of devastating proportions.
Hitler's Circle of Evil
Surviving power struggles, betrayals and plots, Hitler's inner circle of Nazi leaders seizes control of Germany and designs its disastrous future.
The Story of Ming Lan
The Story of Ming Lan, based on the novel written by Guan Xin Ze Luan, follows our heroine through her youth, into her adulthood, and well into her marriage life as well. She’s the 6th child of the Sheng household. Though she is an intelligent and beautiful child, she was not loved by her family (her dad, her sisters, her mom dies early.) She has to hide her intelligence and suffers through the years, hoping to avenge for her mom. During this process she will meet many friends and foes, one of which is our male lead, Gu’s second son, Gu Ting Ye. He has helped and mistreated her before, but also the one to witness her sharp wits and lonely soul. After they get married, they will work together as a power couple, managing the new King’s regime as well as harvesting a world of happiness on their own.
World War Two
Follow the deadliest conflict in human history in real time, week by week, blow by blow.
Princess Margaret: The Rebel Royal
This two-part series profiles Princess Margaret, whose life and loves reflected the social and sexual revolution that transformed Britain during the 20th century.
Penny Dreadful: City of Angels
Rooted in the conflict between characters connected to the deity Santa Muerte and others allied with the Devil, this saga explores an exciting mix of the supernatural and the combustible reality of 1938 Los Angeles, a time and place deeply infused with Mexican-American folklore and social tension.
Deep Water
Follow three women as they each make life-changing mistakes regarding their children and husbands, which lead to unpredictable criminal consequences. Based on Paula Daly's best selling novel, Windermere.
World on Fire
The story of World War II told through the intertwining fates of ordinary people from all sides of this global conflict as they grapple with the effect of the war on their everyday lives.
Shadowplay
In 1946 Berlin, an American cop searches for his missing brother while helping a novice German policewoman fight the violent crimes engulfing the city.
Rise of the Nazis
How did 20th Century Europe's most liberal democracy fall into the hands of fascists? From Hitler's political scheming that turned Germany's parliament into a House of Cards, his War on Truth leading to book burning, and his scapegoating of minorities, this series explores in extraordinary detail the events leading up to the outbreak of World War II.
The Undoing
Grace and Jonathan Fraser are living the only lives they ever wanted. Overnight a chasm opens in their lives: a violent death and a chain of terrible revelations. Left behind in the wake of a spreading and very public disaster, Grace must dismantle one life and create another for her child and her family.
The Plot Against America
An alternate American history told through the eyes of a working-class Jewish family in New Jersey, as they watch the political rise of Charles Lindbergh, an aviator-hero and xenophobic populist, who becomes president and turns the nation toward fascism.
Mare of Easttown
A detective in a small Pennsylvania town investigates a local murder while trying to keep her life from falling apart.
Gold Digger
Gold Digger tells the story of wealthy 60 year old Julia as she falls in love with Benjamin, a man 25 years her junior. As this six part series progresses the impact their unconventional relationship has on her family is explored and the secrets of their past are revealed. Has Julia finally found the happiness she's always deserved? Or is Benjamin really the gold digger they think he is?
Hunters
A diverse band of Nazi Hunters living in 1977 New York City discover that hundreds of high ranking Nazi officials are living among us and conspiring to create a Fourth Reich in the U.S. The eclectic team of Hunters set out on a bloody quest to bring the Nazis to justice and thwart their new genocidal plans.
Atlantic Crossing
The incredible, true story of the Norwegian Crown Princess Märtha’s efforts to support her country during World War II. After a headlong flight from the Nazis, she was forced to part from her husband and cross the Atlantic Ocean to seek refuge in the United States. There, she soon found herself involved in a close relationship with the President of the United States: Franklin D. Roosevelt.
Our Miracle Years
In a politically, morally and economically destroyed country, three sisters of an industrialist family in post-war Germany reinvent themselves and set the course for their future.
Penance
Following the loss of their son, Rosalie and Luke find their marriage under immense strain. Maddie and Rosalie find themselves in the caring hands of Jed, a charming and charismatic young man that they encounter at bereavement counselling who is also suffering under the weight of his own grief. Jed rekindles a hope for the future within the Douglas household. But underneath, a deadly and morally corrupt triangle is taking shape.
Ridley Road
During London's swinging sixties, young Jewish Vivien Epstein follows her lover into danger and when he is caught between life and death, she finds herself going undercover with the fascists, not only for him but for the sake of her country.
Secrets of the Third Reich
Little-known events that played a large role in determining the outcome of World War II are revealed in this documentary series.
Exterminate All the Brutes
Hybrid docuseries offering an expansive exploration of the exploitative and genocidal aspects of European colonialism, from America to Africa, and its impact on society today.
Apples Never Fall
Follow the Delaneys, who from the outside appear to be an enviably contented family. Former tennis coaches Joy and Stan are parents to four adult children. After fifty years of marriage, they have finally sold their famed tennis academy and are ready to start what should be the golden years of their lives. But after Joy disappears, her children are forced to re-examine their parents’ marriage and their family history with fresh eyes.
Nazi Megastructures: Russia's War
The story of Hitler’s war on the Eastern Front – an attempt to liquidate the Russian people and gain living space for his superior Aryan race. It is a conquest that takes the Nazis all the way to the gates of Moscow and back to the heart of Berlin, and culminates in the collapse of the Third Reich. The series reveals the cunning strategy, defensive megastructures and military technology deployed in this devastating war of brutality between giants.
Inside the SS
With the aid of rare archives, this film retraces the bloody history of the SS, some of whose members are still alive and have accepted to speak.
The Lost Flowers of Alice Hart
After losing her parents to a mysterious fire, nine-year-old Alice Hart is raised by her grandmother June on a flower farm where she learns there are secrets within secrets. But years on, an unearthed betrayal sees Alice forced to face her past.
Magpie Murders
An editor gets drawn into a web of intrigue and murder when she receives an unfinished manuscript.
All the Light We Cannot See
A blind French girl and a young German soldier's paths collide during WWII.
A Small Light
Twentysomething Miep Gies didn't hesitate when her boss Otto Frank came to her and asked her to hide his family from the Nazis during World War II. For the next two years, Miep, her husband Jan, and the other helpers watched over the eight souls in hiding in the Secret Annex. And it was Miep who found Anne’s Diary and kept it safe so Otto, the only one of the eight who survived, could later share it with the world as one of the most powerful accounts of the Holocaust.
We Were the Lucky Ones
The true story of one Jewish family separated at the start of World War II, determined to survive—and to reunite.
The Company You Keep
A night of passion leads to love between con man Charlie and undercover CIA officer Emma, who are unknowingly on a collision course professionally. While Charlie ramps up the ‘family business’ so he can get out for good, Emma’s closing in on the vengeful criminal who holds Charlie’s family debts in-hand — forcing them to reckon with the lies they’ve told so they can save themselves and their families from disastrous consequences.
The U.S. and the Holocaust
Inspired in part by the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum’s “Americans and the Holocaust” exhibition and supported by its historical resources, this documentary series examines the rise of Hitler and Nazism in Germany in the context of global antisemitism and racism, the eugenics movement in the United States, and race laws in the American south.
Killer Sally
Interviews with friends, family and Sally McNeil herself chart a bodybuilding couple’s rocky marriage — and its shocking end in a Valentine's Day murder.
The Spencer Sisters
Former police officer Darby Spencer and her mystery novelist mother Victoria Spencer have opposite personalities but still embark on the unlikeliest of ventures: becoming partners in a private detective agency. They are mistaken as sisters as they tackle puzzling cases in Alder Bluffs.
The Tattooist of Auschwitz
The powerful real-life story of Lali Sokolov, a Jewish prisoner who was tasked with tattooing ID numbers on prisoners' arms in the Auschwitz-Birkenau concentration camp during World War II.
The Couple Next Door
Evie and Pete move into an upscale neighborhood and find themselves in a world of curtain twitching and status anxiety. They find friendship in the shape of the couple next door, alpha traffic cop Danny and his wife, glamorous yoga instructor Becka, but after Danny and Evie share a passionate night together there is trouble ahead.
This Is Us
Follows the lives and families of three adults living and growing up in the United States of America in present and past times. As their paths cross and their life stories intertwine in curious ways, we find that several of them share the same birthday - and so much more than anyone would expect.